How Education will Propel Your Career and Income in the exciting world of Real Estate Management with Barry Blanton

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Lyle Crews: All right. We are here for our inaugural North Seattle College, all things, real estate podcast and with us today, we have the my partner in crime, Mark Potter. I am faculty at North Marcus Faculty at North, and we’ve been developing our real estate and property management program for the last several years. The goal of this shows to bring you guys some of the greatest, smartest minds in the industry.

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Lyle Crews: and with our nuggle guess we feel like man. We struck gold. so, Mr. Barry Blanton, we’re gonna have. You tell us a little bit about you. Tell the world a little bit about yourself.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Well, first of all, I I am so thrilled to be here with with the both of you and everybody that’s listening. thank you very much for having me so yes, I’m Barry Blanton. I am the chief problem solver at Blanton Turner, which is a real estate management consulting company here, based in Seattle. we started in 2,012,

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and our 2,011 actually. And I last year served as the pre international President of the Institute of Real Estate management

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and so that’s just a little bit about me. And while I might not be the best in the brightest mind in the business. I’m here.

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Lyle Crews: this. It’s a little bit of a different space. So you’ve been traveling around, and you know I’ve been. I’ve been following you through your journeys through your I Room mission with many of the programs that are launching real estate and real estate management curriculums. So before we get into the question. Questions. Tell us a little bit about that, and why

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Lyle Crews: that’s been so important to you, because a lot of people don’t necessarily think they need more education to do this field. And so one of the things that we’ve been coming across out there is, you know. What’s the ro? Why do I need? Why, what’s the what’s the value of

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Lyle Crews: like this? Real estate means that our property management degree. So before we get into the question, questions about you. Tell us a little bit about why, what you’ve been experiencing as you’ve been around the country and into all over the world, and what you’re feeling about the state of the industry as we go forward.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Well, great question First and foremost understand that I started in this industry when I was going to the University of Oregon, and they didn’t have, course, work in regards to what real estate management was about, or really anything about it. And so, as as I look at our opportunities today, and I’ve gotten a chance to meet students, as you said, all over the world now.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I’m just thrilled that that these opportunities exist.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: awareness of this industry and profession is improving.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and to this day people don’t understand what opportunities there are in this profession. I was in Chicago last year, and we were in the top of the John Hancock Tower about 96 floors up, and all day long I’d been hearing leaders across the country say, people just aren’t aware of our profession or this industry at all. And so I had everybody go to the windows look out the windows, and every building they could see, as far as they could see, was downtown Chicago.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Every building is managed by somebody. These are multi 1 million, if not 1 billion dollar real estate investment. Somebody manages those things.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And the good news is, there aren’t enough people yet.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: There’s lots of opportunity out there for a lot of people with a lot of different disciplines. So so education and the colleges and universities we’re working with, they’re helping get the word out and helping identify those those future professionals that are going to join this industry. Really exciting?

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Lyle Crews: All right. So, Mark, I’m going to take this first formal question, and you will feel, follow. Okay? So in just backing up. So your career path, you mentioned kind of getting started yu, or at that other school in the Northwest. and I’ll be funny because I’m actually a terr PIN. So I’m from your. But my parents are, are, are are

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Lyle Crews: we’re both Washington huskies. So tell us about your career path. How did you get started?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Sure I would tell you that. I would not. I would not say mine was a great plan, but but it worked out. Okay. So sometimes you take luck or brains and you take luck. I I got lucky my career path started. I needed a job while I was going to the University of Oregon, and I got a job through a real estate broker. I knew mowing lines

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and bottom line was that real, really terrible at it?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And I was doing this for a small management company that she owned. And I thought, Okay, I know I don’t want to be mowing lines. How do I get into doing showings? And I was told, well, there’s really no way to do that.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and I love it when people tell me there’s no way to do that. And so, as soon as I said, Well, why aren’t we open on Saturday, he said. Well, you could be open on Saturdays if you want to clean the office, and then you can do some showing. The answer sometimes is not

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Barry Blanton, CPM: not the answer given to you? The answer sometimes is to go around that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: that was my career path. So one thing led to another. I I started working in the office. while I was going to college.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I asked why we weren’t managing apartments, he said. Well, there’s no future in apartments. It’s all about houses and duplexes in Eugene, and I said, Well, if there’s no future in it, would you mind if I tried to pick up some apartments, and if I can find some you can pay me, and if I can’t, I guess I don’t.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And he said, Well, sure, so sometimes it’s about people not getting in your way. Why, you see something they don’t see.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: That’s an opportunity, too. I ended up being a partner with him for about 20 years. We ended up growing that company, and it became a primarily apartment management company and again locker brains. It was luck, and it was tenacity.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and it was figuring out what maybe others didn’t see. and and I would tell you that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I was not probably the greatest student in the world. And I look at the students that are in the classes now, and I’m thinking they are so far, much farther ahead than I was.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: because they’re doing something to improve their lot in life.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And and I I what that wasn’t my mindset. But that’s that’s how it came to be. And then one thing led to another, and one opportunity led to another, and

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and I was fortunate. So, but that’s how I get started in it. It’s not glamour and it certainly wasn’t. It wasn’t a situation where I thought, okay, this seems like a good profession. To go into

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Barry Blanton, CPM: the best things about this profession is.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: it doesn’t matter what your bent happens to be, what your passion happens to be. There’s lots of opportunity in this in this arena.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: no matter how you’re wired, it’s just a matter of exploring what those opportunities are being exposed to those.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and that’s what we’re out there to do. Now.

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Mark Potter: that’s a great comment, because what we and engage our students with is exactly that pathway that there’s you.

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Mark Potter: This is just an incredible industry. Real estate industry gives you just

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Mark Potter: it in numerous iterations of job opportunities that you know if you if you’re not, if you in a job, and that’s not exactly your fit pivot. There’s a lot of room to pivot.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Absolutely right, Mark. it’s kind of under it’s it’s it’s it’s not lost on me that there’s a bit of a that misnomer. We talk about real estate management. What are we really doing?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: We’re managing investments for people.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: You have a financial element to it. There’s an accounting element to it. There’s the people element to it. We’re really in the people management business, because what we’re trying to do is to provide exceptional experiences for people

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Barry Blanton, CPM: through real estate.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: But it isn’t just about property management. It’s about, how do you? How do you do something really? Well, to provide value to the people that are using that real estate. whether that’s the investment value, whether that’s the value of where you live or where you work or play.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and so there are. There’s just a a ton of opportunities. And storytelling is part of it, too, by the way, way, under underestimated, and we live in a day and age where good storytelling is really important.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And so, if any of those things are the things that that your students are passionate about. Those are opportunities in this industry

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Mark Potter: that leads me into my question. My next question is, we talk about the real estate profession, and how it truly is. A client service. It’s a people business so very. How do you? How did you build your professional credibility to be that? Go to person

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Mark Potter: that person in your clients when they had a problem that they needed to solve.

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Mark Potter: they thought of you

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Mark Potter: and cause that’s very important, because there’s a lot of competition out there and all jobs now that we are on also global. So how did you get that credibility? So they went very.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: So that’s a great question. Mark. I I would say this.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: there are some factions in some parts of this industry that you really you really do have that professionalism side. Right? There’s the accounting side. There’s the finance side. There’s all that acumen that you need to learn. My, my entry into. This was my ability to figure out things I hadn’t encountered before.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and and there everything is not written in a book. I I would say I’ve been doing this for 43 years personally, and I I last week ran into 15 things I never seen before in 43 years, and so ours is the ability to figure it out, or then people to know, or the ability to connect connect dots to those people that can help you

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Barry Blanton, CPM: right? And so and so, if if somebody has a bent towards not being stymied when the answer isn’t a parent. But instead, look at that as the puzzle we’re trying to solve

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and then help solve it. Then you get to. You look pretty wicked smart to those people that maybe get stymied when they when they run into that. That’s that’s what happened in my, in my case, and I think happened in a lot of people’s cases that are in this they start out at more as a utility player, and that’s a good place to start out, by the way, because then you’ll know whether or not you really want to play this game. That game. You’re better at this position or that position, and and all of them are important. So

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Barry Blanton, CPM: try it. If you’re a student, try all kinds of things. You might be surprised what really you’re passionate about. You just aren’t aware of it yet.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And and then you can pursue that because there’s there’s depth and all of it, but being a utility player, was helpful. I would tell you this. I I heard this the other day from

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Barry Blanton, CPM: it was it happened to be the captain of the Duke Women’s basketball team talking to her team.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and it was so smart because she’s saying, you know, everybody says, geez life is, gonna I just can’t wait for life to get a little easier. And let me tell you, something folks like does not get easier. You just get better at harder.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And so life does get harder. But you get better at a dealing with those things that are difficult, and that does. That is absolutely true. I keep notes from every year since I started this. I’ve got my handwritten notes from every day of every year. It’s just it’s it’s a sickness. But I can go back and see 2022 years ago what I used to be really fuss about.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and it’s kind of laughable now, because it seems pretty easy now, because things did get harder. But I would tell. I would tell any student that we cared to listen

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Lyle Crews: might not get easier. But you will get better at the harder stuff. And that’s life, right? So, Barry, you, you mentioned something I just have to throw in, because funny. I was teaching last night, and I had that exact conversation. I’m not quite as many years, but I’m 35 plus 30, something year 33, and I was like every day something happens. I don’t know the answers to the differences. It’s not overwhelming, because I know how to get the answers. But every day or something with the building, some with a person in a situation, a new hall.

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Lyle Crews: You know this part of your education is just the beginning.

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Lyle Crews: It’s that foundation one of the things we’ve come across is to say, well, I can get a job with just a certificate like, yeah.

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Lyle Crews: but you’re limiting yourself. The the thing that you mentioned about it. It’s gonna get hard, and it gets easier around the things that are hard. It doesn’t make it unharmed. And really, to me, that’s the value proposition.

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Lyle Crews: and one has to sort of reflame their thinking to master any industry which is, you’re never done educating yourself. Life is about continuous improvement. It’s Kaizen for those that don’t know. They’ll look it up

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Lyle Crews: and see the power of that way of thinking. It drives my life, and I’ve been a lifelong learner, you know more formally the last years I went back, and, you know, added to my education. But you’re never done learning. You’ll never have enough certificates. You never have enough classes, because it’s just like.

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Lyle Crews: just like technology of the building products.

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Lyle Crews: The products that they use 75 years ago are outdated and and just plain.

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Lyle Crews: you know no of no value today. Look at the entrance of not name it the Lvp. Name of it.

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Lyle Crews: You can watch the hot day high in Httv. Shows the you know they’re using on the high end upgrades. Lvp, and you would go. Why, instead of hardwood guys go look up. Why.

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Lyle Crews: and then the technology in that in the last 4 or 5 years, and the cost model has changed. So like when we deal with multi-plan, we like what or or any kind of rental property that’s

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Lyle Crews: for residential. Why, the heck would use carpet that you got to change every 2 or 3 years and you can use, there’ll be P. It’s gonna last you 20 to 25 years, or maybe a lifetime. And whether the challenges of humans, dogs, kids spills.

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Lyle Crews: But I get in the fight with donors because they don’t want to spend 20% more money. I’m like, you’re gonna spend 150 more money by saving 20%

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Lyle Crews: you that they are but being penny wise and dollar for so those are the. But that’s not what I would have said to you 25 years ago, because I’m a consumer as well, and every day you go. Oh, my God, how much is that?

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Mark Potter: Wait a minute! This is an investment. And it’s that it’s about understanding the revenue model which we talk about a lot in our classes. So moving on to the next question, because at least

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Mark Potter: very strong statement about being a utilitarian, which also crosses that into that section of being a journalist

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Mark Potter: which leads Barry and all of us in our profession, with our background. Education that we continually take is that it gives you that book of questions to ask, and so our success, very success is knowing what question to ask.

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Mark Potter: We don’t have the answer, but we know the question, and we know who to look for so. But excellent! I just got goosebumps. I just got goose. No spirit.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: but you know your spot on, and here’s the here’s the last thing I’d say, and and then we’ll get to your next question. Now, it’s

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Barry Blanton, CPM: the good news about lifelong learning, and I love that. I mean, we. We talk about that a lot in Iran. We’ve talked about that a lot at different colleges. that’s that’s absolutely spot on.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: as you continue. The best news about lifelong learning is you’re not always playing from behind to catch up. What you’re doing is you’re finding the passion you want to know more about. And then pretty soon you’re picking that thing you want to learn about, because you’re passionate about it. And then it’s not just an assignment in a class.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: It’s because you want to master something and going back to what Mark was just saying. Yes, you start off as a generalist, as a utilitarian. you know. utility player. If you will.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: you will start to specialize in those things that you’re passionate about. People just naturally do that. And then going back to your first question, Mark, why do people come back.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Why do they ask you? Because you will become that expert because you are passionate about it. You took that initiative to learn more about it, and then they’re using you to connect the dots, make the world smaller. It’s good, fuck it.

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Lyle Crews: Starting as a generalist

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Lyle Crews: that leads in the specialization. And I want for our audience and our listeners that that are contemplating should I be? What kind of education for my career that we’re pursuing? Can I get a return on investment, because that’s something. A lot of people, especially young people, are really valuing today. But I always like to. My students like, think about it. If you are in the medical field, for example.

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Lyle Crews: who is a more profitable, the generalist or the specialist, you know, the the even in attorneys, or any field

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Lyle Crews: the general gives you the foundation. But in specialty, if you’ve got a unique specific problem. you’re going to go look for the specialists, and it’s always going to be a more costly experience, because there’s only a few people that know how to do that particular thing.

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Lyle Crews: If you are starting, you know a students that are thinking about this. I’m in school right now. I’m I’m working on my business degree. I don’t know about this thing called real estate and real estate, management, property management, this whole field.

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Lyle Crews: What’s the future of that? From a career standpoint you mentioned before accounting finance? We so we could go into marketing And now you got a whole social media thing. It’s a whole thing by itself, you know. We always like to tell the students that there’s some pathways within the pathways. Please take a look at how you can use being the business of real estate. Can you speak more to our in that? You’re seeing in the education as you’re out there in the in the world as you’re out there in the field.

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Lyle Crews: How is that becoming more important as we’re moving forward. And why should someone even consider this kind of education from your point of view, both with all your unique positions as a firm owner as I? You know, whole background there, and just what you’re seeing as you’ve been out having a chance to be at the colleges. What’s your take on that? Why? Why should someone look into this

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Barry Blanton, CPM: great question? in a deep question. I I think, first of all, you mentioned Roi right where students are looking for return on investment.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and often they’re thinking in terms of dollars.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: the dollars are true that that’s a true return on investments, but so is your passion. So is your happiness, you know. If you’re wasting time doing something you’re unhappy doing.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: you’re losing. That’s a lost investment, because your time is worth something. All of these things are really tough to tell a student when they’re out trying to get a job, their first job, or maybe a more significant job. And they’ve got real

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Barry Blanton, CPM: life issues that they have to deal with in terms of making payments and paying rent and doing all the other stuff. But these are things to think about. I think that when it comes to education. the way I look at it is this, I I particularly like people that have taken the time

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Barry Blanton, CPM: to to go to a college or university, because just because of what we talked about in terms of the generalist thing, if if somebody comes, and they are looking at one thing right. And this is the one thing they want to do. What if that one thing proves not to be their passion.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: then do they leave it

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Barry Blanton, CPM: right? And and and so I think that the first 2 years of college, the first 3 years of college are excellent for getting a taste of a lot of things. and and the best news about this industry is all of those things exist in it.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Right. We talk about. You talk about people getting a business degree. It’s a very general degree. Generally speaking, when you’re talking about a business degree, people want to get into business, and they’re thinking in terms of things like finance or running a business, or whatever 150.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I was just talking to somebody in Kansas City earlier today. And we were talking about this very thing. What is a building that is worth 140 million dollars, if not an investment, if not a business. And what other industry can somebody that’s relatively young but well educated learning every day become a CEO of a business that’s worth 140,000, or 140 million dollars

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Barry Blanton, CPM: or more. We we had a 25 year old managing a tower that’s 43 stories tall in downtown Seattle

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Barry Blanton, CPM: because she was really good at it. Right? She had a team of 19. You’re managing people. You’re managing a business that has a multi 1 million dollar year business, that budget.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: It’s an asset worth hundreds of millions of dollars. Yes, that’s real estate, but it’s a business. And so with that, said,

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Barry Blanton, CPM: what is college in in education do for you? I think that it it broadens your scope, it broads your awareness of things. It gives you a taste of a lot of things, and that is, it’s it’s it’s kind of a it’s. It’s sort of a buffet of different tastes that you get a chance to take a a nibble at

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and then determine whether or not that’s for you or not. And if even if it isn’t today it might be tomorrow, once you understand more about it. So so I think that that’s good. I also think that I look for people who want to learn

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Barry Blanton, CPM: right? And what are what are what are students coming coming out of out of college, showing already

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Barry Blanton, CPM: that they not only had the appetite to learn.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: They also finished. They also showed commitment, serious commitment.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And and all of those things are good things that you’re looking for and people that are going to manage your multi 1 million dollar businesses.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: All right.

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Okay?

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Mark Potter: Next question.

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Mark Potter: Okay, Next question we will lead into is there? How can a pro prospective student gain practical experience in property management while in college, and what steps should they take to enhance their chances to secure a job in the field upon graduation.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: great question. And I now I would tell you you don’t have to start by mowing lawns that you you can start a little higher than that. It’s for some of us that’s where it started. I. Personally.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I think sometimes people get tripped up with this idea of internships, and I can tell you from the owner of a business standpoint.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: My first business, my first down in Oregon we had in terms that were graduate student interns, and we took it really seriously. So we wanted it to be a great internship, and we had them come in.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: that can be a lot of onus on a business owner, and so they’ll sometimes shy away from internships because they don’t want to have a bad one. They want to have a good one, and if they don’t have a good one they won’t have one.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I think this, I think that most internships I hear about these days are paid internships. Basically, what are we talking about? We’re talking about part time jobs, what people are in college.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: right?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: That seems to me that the easiest thing in the world. There is a huge need out there for people to work. There’s lots of opportunity out there. If you think you want to get into this area.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Get a part time job while you’re in college.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And and I would tell you you don’t have to have more experience than being somebody that you’re going to be working with. If if if the target market of that apartment complex

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Barry Blanton, CPM: are people that might be of your age, or might want to live in that area that you’re living in or or have work in that area where you’re living.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: All of those things you bring to bear, because you have some sense about what they they value.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And that’s what the company needs to know is what is the customer value.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Well, you’re helping because you are potentially a customer, but what you’re doing is go to work part time. If you hate leasing, you don’t have to be a leasing person, but you get your foot in the door, and then pretty soon you can become an assistant manager, and you start to learn more about it. The accounting part of it, or the software part of it or or technology, part of it or marketing part of it.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And then you get you get to move into those areas. And you take those part time jobs. But but don’t go in with your eyes with blinders on. Go in with the idea that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: maybe for you it’s an internship for them. It’s filling a job. Need

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Barry Blanton, CPM: part of it, too, is you’re looking to see whether the culture of that place is right for you right

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Barry Blanton, CPM: today. The best news in the world for students today is we live in an in an an environment where moving and taking a variety of jobs is an expectation now. It didn’t used to be, but it is now, and so therefore give it your best. Make sure you leave your best on the field. If it isn’t for you, then go find the thing that is. But you’re going to learn something from the last one.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I would say this, too, you learn from best practices and lessons learned.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And so sometimes you’ll never want to be like that. Sometimes you’ll always want to be like that. You’re gonna learn from both of those just you know. Stay aware. And but but I would say, if it was me I’d get a job. I’d get a little part time job, whatever I could do if it’s weekends, if it’s evenings.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: whatever it is Actually, one of your students is just started an internship with us because she was passionate about

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Barry Blanton, CPM: affordable housing. And so we’ve got her working on an internship and affordable housing.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I could not be happier about that.

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Lyle Crews: Hopefully she’ll stay with us. We’ll see

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Mark Potter: we’re very excited about that, and that’s one of the things that

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Mark Potter: L. And I do have. The faculty in our program is to help the students bridge that gap into employment. And so we actually have members of the community that will come to us with opportunities, and we guide students to that path. It’s up to them to take the reins. We just pass it on, but it’s very exciting. So there’s opportunities. And it’s also

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Mark Potter: I. I also find that getting into work environment gives you a chance to do what you just mentioned. Iterations and cross silos and get to see something, and you’ll go. You may be in leasing, and maybe you don’t, you know that’s you. You like it. But then you see something, somebody else. What a what are the groups doing you like? I’m gonna do what they’re doing. So yeah, that really works well.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Yep.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: one more add on to that. Mark is relationships matter, too.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And so you’re a student, you get to go and you work in a in a company. Maybe it is for you. Maybe it isn’t for you. But now you know a bit more about what you’re looking for.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: If you build good relationships with people people want to help people they like or they know.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And so that’s part of it, too, you know. I mean, it’s just a matter of how do we make it? Not 6 degrees of separation, but make it 2. And and so I would say, working in the industry and getting to know people and building relationships. There’s nothing there’s not a downside to doing that.

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Mark Potter: One last point I’ll I’ll make on. That is one thing that I found in my career in in associates I’ve known is being able to be in the work, environment and joining that with an education, you take those educational tools into the workplace the next day, and it’s amazing exercise. And it also accelerates your career, development and advancement.

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Mark Potter: Because you’re you’re you’ve got some extra tools. So

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Mark Potter: thank you. That’s excellent, excellent.

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Lyle Crews: you know. I’m looking at this next question, and you’ve kind of answered it. But I’m going to just refine this a little bit. I mean the the the kind of thing, and I think you said it. So what advice would you get to a prospective student? Interest in in in percent of current. I think you really had already. But

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Lyle Crews: what skills and qualities do you think? And I I you know, as I was listening to both of you about that. I was thinking about sort of that evolving

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Lyle Crews: building up of the from the generalist to the foundation. And those skills are quality. So I’m going to pig you back on this last question that Mark asked.

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Lyle Crews: Those skills are qualities that you would think are most successful in this industry. The core ones. There’s 2 or 3,

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Lyle Crews: you know, to put you on the spot. What would be true for those things that you think jump out at you, that you found that really needed for someone to grow their career?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I think, agility. I think that.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I’m going to say this with the proviso, but I think that the the ability to pivot

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Barry Blanton, CPM: we will not run into the same things every day. Generally speaking, unless the proviso, I was gonna say is is less. You happen to be working in the accounting department or in something that’s a little more based on principles and and and routines.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I also think this sometimes students that I talk to will overlook something, because to them it’s obvious, right? They they do social media and technology like they breathe.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Well, if you got started in 1,980, like I did, maybe that isn’t like breathing to me. So what can you bring? You bring a new

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Barry Blanton, CPM: awareness, a new set of skills that you think everybody might have. And I would say, look outside of yourself and look more broadly. You are not necessarily competing with just everybody that does everything the same you have, and and therefore you’re not unique. That’s not true at all.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And I would tell you. What can the what can you bring to the company? It’s not just what that that business or that that job brings to you.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: But think outside of what you take for granted.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and ask yourself, what do you have to contribute to the company? Because that’s going to help you with confidence, not arrogance. There’s a difference.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: but confidence, so that if you do your homework on that company before you talk to them, I’m sorry I probably skipping ahead. I don’t know, but always do your homework on the company, because if there, if their social presence, social media presence isn’t great, that’s an opportunity that they can use. If their website is a little antiquated, it hasn’t been updated in about 7 years. That’s an opportunity.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: You know how important that is. A student. You. You deal with that stuff every day all day, and they might not.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And so what can you do for them? That’s something I would always ask as you as you’re talking, because everybody wants to contribute and be valued.

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Lyle Crews: you know. There, you just said something really important. I want our, you know, protect potential students or anybody in their career path.

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Lyle Crews: A lot of times I’ve experienced. You know, there’s a big hit on the millennials today. But it’s a big experience of.

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Lyle Crews: Maybe you’re looking at a negative of a company I well, I love what you said about hey? That’s an opportunity. And trust me. Once you get over a certain age, as my niece would say. Ok, well, you’re older at the what she made. You’re now 30. So

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Lyle Crews: she’s getting married, we’re going to a white for our wedding, but now she’s got 3 little ones. But here’s the deal

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Lyle Crews: that thing about. What value can I bring that they don’t have.

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Lyle Crews: How if you have so, how respectfully could someone bring those ideas and be heard when maybe some of those older folks

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Lyle Crews: might not be because we’re uncomfortable, like, you say, with some of the technology, how? How would you recommend a student go about or not a student, but a someone in their career early, sees an opportunity, and learn how to respectfully deliver that so they can be heard. If you have any thoughts about that.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Well, first and foremost. I mean, generally speaking, what happens in these interviews is they they tend to be one way which I always think is like, that’s too bad, you know that that’s that’s a miss already. Right? But but if the employer is doing the interviewing.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: what what you really need to try to understand is as as the interview. We

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Barry Blanton, CPM: is what matters to the employer. Right? And they’re they’re going to tell you what matters. But then you can have done a little research.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And it’s just possible that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I, for example, just coming out of college and just having gone through the hard work of college and in college, is hard. You did work there so often. People just say, Oh, I just got out of this program in this program. They never get into. What did that entail.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Right? It was a research. Yeah. Generally speaking, there was research. Was there working with people? Yeah, there was working with people, was there leadership skills? Yeah, because generally.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I I you might want to kept this part out. But generally, if you get into a group in college, 20% of the people in the group do 80% of the work right? The leaders?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Well, I’m sorry. But you know we’re looking for the leaders, you know. So so I would just say that that you know. How do you? How do you bring it up? I guess you could be inquisitive without arrogance about what they do and how they do it, what is? Start with their success? What is the key to that company’s success? Let them tell you the story. If they’re not great at telling you the story, then reiterate it back in a way that might be even a better story.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: right? Because what are you telling? You’re telling them their story better than they just told it to you.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: That’s pretty good.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: People love people that love them. I’m just gonna say so. So it’s it influenced people, China. So so I would. I would say, if there was one thing I could tell anyone out looking

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Barry Blanton, CPM: for an internship, a a part time job or a permanent career. Interview them back

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Barry Blanton, CPM: because your time you only have so much time, and if you waste time someplace you should not be.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: That’s not a good thing, because you’re not going to be your best. They’re not going to get your best. and you’re not going to stay. So you really do need to be interviewing them back. and it isn’t just what they can do for you. It’s what you can do for them that you’re not gonna know that unless you have a really good conversation with them.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: right? And it might not be a fit. And it’s okay if it’s not a fit. But if you interview well and they interview well, you’re going to figure out what they can do for you, and you can do for them, and everybody’s going to leave happy.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Does that make sense? Absolutely? Yeah.

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Mark Potter: As we open

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Mark Potter: use the 80 20 principal Barry, I I learned that one early in my career. And I passed that on to students all the time. Yeah, I remember it early in my career. You’re just fighting for any client to pick up the phone and you took on any client. And then, after you looked at your book, a business you like. Hmm.

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Mark Potter: yeah, 80, 2020 of my clients I’m going along with. They produce 80% of my income. The other group.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: it’s time to have a discussion. It is, it is, you know, absolutely. And people avoid those right. They they walk around it. I think a lot of times people take responsibility for when something isn’t a fit to too often, maybe put too much of it on themselves.

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Lyle Crews: or they’re so in need of something, a job, or whatever. Everything looks pretty good. Yeah, that’s a powerful point. You know, we had a recent session with several tremendously professionals on the business, and several came from our field, and it was amazing how often that came up from our, our, our panel.

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Lyle Crews: and how curved and not straight aligned or path. Often, when we’re young, we think the path is straight. Later you’re on. There’s nothing straight about it. And like you mentioned earlier today, it’s so much less that way. No one, no one’s expected any more to go to one company. It’s been 30 years doing the same job.

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Lyle Crews: Fact. That’s just not the world we’re really, we’re really operating in anymore. And the ability to pivot mark. Do that work pivot a lot. And we talk to our students about that.

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Lyle Crews: So Mark, you, got the next question. It kind of leads right into that.

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Mark Potter: Yeah, are we talking about the I have. It is question 6. Is that what you where you’re at? Because I think I got we skipped one. So are we on the

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Mark Potter: I mean, you keep on less than 6 on your list. Yeah.

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Mark Potter: we’re in these meetings and podcasts and reaching out to the industry.

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Mark Potter: is that we have. We are telling our story, and we’ve talked about some of these points already, but

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Mark Potter: you know there are a lot of students and prospects in our community that come to us and say, Well, why do I need a A certificate from your from the college, and why do I need a a degree to help me in my career?

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Mark Potter: And so I you’ve always touched on this, but I mean we could distill it a little bit more. And how do you feel about enrolling in a college real estate education program? How can that help students thrive in the field.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Yeah.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I great question. And I think I I

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Barry Blanton, CPM: a couple of thoughts come to mind number one.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: It’s relatively new that people are pursuing degrees in real estate management. Great news. That’s great news for the students that are doing that.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: because while the industry might not be used to that there is a huge need in this industry just to throw out a couple of of statistics.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I remember Cpm members alone.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and this is a couple of years old now are managing 2 trillion 100 billion dollars with the real estate in the Us. Alone.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Okay, that now, Iran’s global. Now, that’s just Cpm members in the Us. Alone. 2 trillion, 100 billion dollars for the real estate. That’s 12 million apartments.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: That’s 65% of all the affordable housing in the country. It’s 12 billion square feet of commercial real estate, and those are low numbers, because those are just kind of

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Barry Blanton, CPM: best guess scenarios. And it’s gone up since then. So so there’s lots of opportunity. What? What? Why? Why, a degree, for the reasons that we talked about before number one the student that has gone through and gotten the degree has shown that they will take on hard work

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Barry Blanton, CPM: to, to, to, to get somewhere, to improve their

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Barry Blanton, CPM: their value to that that business that they’re coming to, that they will finish something. They’ll start something and finish something they don’t get easily distracted. and they also will have experienced a variety of things that only I mean not only, but college certainly

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Barry Blanton, CPM: exposes them to. So when they decide they want to do something, they at least have some basis to decide. This might be a good fit for them now, once they’re in the in the company, or they’re working for you, it might be determined. Well, maybe accounting wasn’t their thing. Maybe marketing is, or maybe whatever is management, what I

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Barry Blanton, CPM: but but I think that that’s important, I think, too. Now now people get a head start. And now I’m gonna put on my Irm hat. For a minute the Institute of Real estate management had many of the the classes that you’re gonna get in a in a program. That’s that’s

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Barry Blanton, CPM: like like at North North Seattle.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: that qualifies for the iron courses that you would otherwise have to take. Right?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: So you’re ahead because these courses are not easy and they’re not inexpensive. And so what you’re going to need when you come out of college is some experience. But what do you have going into your next job? That next chapter? You have education that often people wait until they’ve been in this business for a while to go back to get

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Barry Blanton, CPM: you’re ahead.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: So if you look at it sort of in terms of time value. you’re you’re leaping ahead in that regard, too. So I think that those are all important.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I don’t know. The companies necessarily know

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Barry Blanton, CPM: where people can start when they come out with a degree.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Again, if you start as a generalist, you might only be doing what you’re you start doing for, you know, want of a few months or 6 months before they move you into something else. Then you’re going to be proving. That’s that’s that’s education in general, right? Everybody coming out of law school knows everything there is to know that they’re going to teach you in law school and know nothing about how to practice law until you’re out there practicing law. But you have all the tools in the world to know where you’re going to find out information. Right?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I I would say it. It just puts you ahead. It’s just a leg up, and it tells people a lot of things that you might not otherwise, or you might take for granted.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I I just I don’t see it downside

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Barry Blanton, CPM: other question, do you feel? And I I felt this, you feel that education actually accelerates your income potential on a on a quicker timeline. Could you talk about that address? That? Sure? I yes, absolutely, because again.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: not everybody’s gonna start mowing lawns. Right? I say that in jest, but that’s exactly what I did, and it took a while for anybody to pay any attention and get into what it is. I didn’t know what I wanted to do. I really had no idea what I wanted to do. I knew at that time we didn’t have a degree in what you have a agree now in real estate at all.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I was really good at trivial pursuits, because I had changed my major about 8 times right, did not know what it was I was going to do. I’m still pretty good at trivial. But with that said.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: You’re streamlining time. You’re saving time. You’re adding to the acumen, and you’re giving people taste and senses of what it’s about, and giving them some tools that they can

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Barry Blanton, CPM: provide right out of the shoot that that absolutely is going to elevate their game. It’s going to make them more valuable.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And and who are they competing with? I mean? Not it.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I want to be careful here, because I I believe this, too. I don’t believe everybody is competing for the same slice of pizza. Right?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: We don’t know what the other guys competing for, what they really want, and too often we always believe everybody wants the same slice we we’re going for, and therefore we’re just competing back and forth. That’s not necessarily true. But we have to get good at explaining what we are looking for and what we do bring to the game. And I think, having an education does that it really helps you tell your story better, and people too often are not very good at telling their own stories.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: so they get you get some practice in a in a college or university.

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Lyle Crews: So so, Barry, you know. we had talked about little bit. Some prior conversation. Does the need for the the changing environment, this global

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Lyle Crews: that we now find the innovative global reality we find ourselves in talk about the need for diversity. We inclusion as we move into

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Barry Blanton, CPM: 24 and beyond for an industry that hasn’t always been as diverse as it could be. Talk about that, you know. It’s I’ve gotten. I’ve gotten to the point. You’re you’re absolutely right. That as an industry real estate is lagged

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Barry Blanton, CPM: generally speaking, in in terms of some of these these things, and I would I would tell you that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I’ve gotten. So

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I’ve got so enthusiastic about

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Barry Blanton, CPM: what De and I, the the opportunities it represents. Right? We’re sitting here competing with the world at large for talent in in our industry and in our profession.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and the best news is, there is talent out there. We have not connected the dot very well to

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Barry Blanton, CPM: to where we’re going to find the next pool of well educated, talented people, because we haven’t opened our doors before we haven’t. We haven’t told our story before we’re we’re really one of the things we’re worst. At the worst, that is is explaining what these opportunities are

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Barry Blanton, CPM: to the people looking for opportunities. There are other places. Software just took the wave right? Everybody wants to be a software engineer. Right before that it was engineering took the wave. There was a minute, you know, or or accounting took the way for a while. I I would just say that that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: that now, more than ever, it’s important to to the employers. It’s important to the students. It’s important that we

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Barry Blanton, CPM: we’re working in a global world, it and and

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Barry Blanton, CPM: we.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I’m trying to collect my thoughts because I get very enthusiastic about this. I think that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: that not only can you bring in skilled

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Barry Blanton, CPM: people to join your organization, but you can enhance your culture if you get this right, and all of a sudden the culture adds the value

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Barry Blanton, CPM: to why, here versus there, right? And if we are welcoming, and if we, in fact, have this tapestry of cultures and backgrounds and interesting people from

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Barry Blanton, CPM: everywhere

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Barry Blanton, CPM: sharing those things. How much better could it get than that right? And and so and so, you know, it’s it’s something I’m I’m I’m quite passionate about, and I think that our industry is quite.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: quite ready.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and and and is taking steps to embrace. And and I would say that it is.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I don’t want to be Pollyanna about it, because I’m not gonna say that that there aren’t still obstacles. It’s never going to be done. We’re not going to be done.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: We’re gonna be better tomorrow than we were today, and we’re better today than we were yesterday, and we’re gonna continue to get better at this.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: So I’m not sure what done. Looks like. I’m not sure that’s the objective. I think the objective is

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Barry Blanton, CPM: to be a better example for the world to be the case. Study for the world that this whole country was founded on. I mean, that isn’t that. What with the the whole point, was supposed to be.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: except for somewhere along the line, it didn’t end up being that. Well, we’re not done yet.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Maybe we’re just getting started.

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Mark Potter: Well, I think that one of the things that this brings up is that North Seattle College is a gateway to our community for this education.

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Mark Potter: And we’re a valuable resource to Bring students in our community into this industry. And we’re very proud of that.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Yeah, as you should be, and I would tell you, you know, that has been one of the best

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Barry Blanton, CPM: silver linings of being able to go around and and meet different universities and colleges and and and with them.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: because we’re finding time and again. it isn’t just about what people are learning in classes.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: It’s about who’s drawn to these programs, how they’re getting placed in the industry, the industry then holding a building back upon that, it it becomes a partnership, and

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Barry Blanton, CPM: all of the things we’ve just talked about are possible. And and and it’s a critical partner in the the educational system is a critical partner in that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and whether that’s at the community college level, the the high school level, the college level at North Seattle College University level. I mean

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Barry Blanton, CPM: there. There are opportunities everywhere. We just need to to establish what they are and then and then promote them. Support them.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Absolutely right.

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Lyle Crews: all right. I think we’re getting down to the last couple of questions. So

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Lyle Crews: and then fun fun thing is you answered a bunch of them as we went through it. So I think this is kind of the last question of any reflections. So as you, as you reflect back on your own career pathway, and you’ve talked about quite a bit.

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Lyle Crews: What advice would you give you if you were your younger self, your 1819, 2022 year old self?

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Lyle Crews: Of course we’re all 25. So that was but it’s on all says if you were given advice to your younger self, based on now having, what would that look like? We had a magic one. What kind of what kind of career, advice, and and and instruction would you give your younger, your younger, your younger Berry?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: well, some some of this I did, but I would give it to anyone else, too. I would say I would look for more. Yes, and how answers, instead of knowing why answers too often people stop when they’re given a no, and why?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And and if that doesn’t resonate with you.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: keep thinking about what? The yes, and how is? Don’t let somebody just say no. And why, when in fact, you believe something can happen, I would say that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: My younger self was a little, was a little absorbed in how other people might perceive me.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: First. It was because I was young

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Barry Blanton, CPM: that it was because I didn’t have the education, or whatever that somebody else might have, or or I was from Eugene Oregon, and I was competing with people from Portland, Oregon, or or you name it all of these things that we’re distracting

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Barry Blanton, CPM: when in fact. it didn’t matter.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I mean it didn’t matter, you know it, and and so but you can’t know that when you’re young, right? When you’re young, you you think everybody’s competing for the same thing. Everybody wants the same widget. You know. You’re just part of a school of fish. Well, the back of the matter is, you’re not. You’re an individual, and so embrace what it is that makes you an individual

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and and and use it, you know, and and sometimes

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Barry Blanton, CPM: sometimes other people might not see that as the strength. But you know, that’s what you’ve got. You’re just gonna master, whatever it is you’ve got. That’s so. So take that. I would say that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: So if you could get over, I if I was going to tell myself something

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I’ve never liked. Arrogance arrogance really doesn’t have any value.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Confidence does have value, and I think sometimes confidence is is conflated with arrogance. If there was one thing that I wish everybody could understand is, there’s a huge difference between having confidence to do something

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and arrogance

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Barry Blanton, CPM: check arrogance at the door. Right?

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Barry Blanton, CPM: There’s always somebody out there that’s gonna have something over you. But if you don’t get too distracted by that. and if you just feel like well, what you’re bringing is valuable.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: right? And if you don’t know something you can figure it out.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: and and if you can’t figure it out on your own, you know other people that will help you figure it out because you’ll help them

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Barry Blanton, CPM: right. It gets pretty good, I would. I would say, all of those things are things that I would have told my younger self.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I can actually can I ask you a question before you sure? Sure so could you give the prospective students or listen to our program here?

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Mark Potter: How you would recognize the difference between arrogance and confidence.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Can you sure.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Well, I think that that

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Barry Blanton, CPM: I think the way I would describe it is when

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Barry Blanton, CPM: you’re trying to build up your ego by being better than someone else right.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: or feeling

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Barry Blanton, CPM: that you are all that because you have accomplished something that somebody else didn’t accomplish, or you have something that somebody else. Generally speaking, arrogance comes with stuff.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: And and and I would say that confidence comes with an inner self knowing that it’s okay not to know everything.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: It’s just fine not to know everything, because we can figure out what we don’t know. But let’s establish what we don’t know, and let’s not hide from it. Instead, let’s lean into it, and then let’s get in touch with Lyle or Mark, or some of my classmates, or whatever, and let’s just run it by people that are out there to help us. Because if we could, I I think that you can be confident and show some vulnerability. And often people that are arrogant don’t want to show any vulnerability.

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Mark Potter: and it’s a difference between security and then insecurity.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Yes, I think very much so. I think that that arrogance kind of

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Barry Blanton, CPM: kind of masks and security too often, and a lack of communication, you know, and and and quite honestly, I guess I have a believer of this. I think that that if

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Barry Blanton, CPM: you know one of the other things I tell my younger self is, don’t get so stressed out right. If stress worked.

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Mark Potter: Get stressed, baby, bring it. Let’s just get a stress.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: If arrogance works, I want to just be as arrogant as it could possibly be. But if it doesn’t work, and it doesn’t help. Why do we do it? And sometimes it’s to mass things. Sometimes it’s because we think we should be something that we don’t feel we’re measuring up to.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Generally speaking, I think people have a bit of graciousness, and if you’re pretty honest about it, you’re gonna fix it. Whatever mistake you’ve made. Generally

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Barry Blanton, CPM: most of them are not life in depth. We’ll figure it out.

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Mark Potter: Don’t don’t fear to. Don’t fear failure

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Barry Blanton, CPM: right? All year you have to fail to succeed. So I think there’s there’s just man, don’t be afraid of failure. It builds, it builds character. Well, that’s right, you know, and if you do fail, don’t be afraid to call it out and then work to fix it right. It’s it’s like you’re you’re right, I mean, how many times a week or a day. Do we fail? You know, you know they say they say, Einstein, they said, oh, you! You’ve failed a thousand times, you know, I to to admit to like always like, no, I found a thousand ways. It didn’t work.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Yeah, yeah, exactly. That whole process of okay, let’s do this and that. I mean, can you imagine

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Lyle Crews: that we, you know people just take all this stuff for granted, you know. Can you imagine there’s no lights? You just have this council double electricity, and someone’s got this idea. I can take this and make light.

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Barry Blanton, CPM: Okay.

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Lyle Crews: the other 3,000 years of mankind. You got carried it. What you have to have a fire.

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Lyle Crews: I’m gonna have the stuff that goes to these. It wires and turn this thing and make it light up all the time, and now we come back we just take it for granted. I think that’s you know. That’s one of the perfect things I think for us to leave with

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Lyle Crews: our perspective career into real estate pathway folks is that you’re gonna learn about a thousand ways not to do things as you learn how to become competent as you build up your confidence, which really then comes from.

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Lyle Crews: and then it’s a real confidence. It’s like a quarter. You’ve got to throw an interception. I don’t care if you’re Tom Brady. You’re gonna don’t need completion. You’re gonna don’t in it for those who are for sports reference. My wife would smack me right now. You know, we have to learn to fall down so we can get up and always like to say if we were as hard on babies as we would on our older, on ourselves we would never walk, because you’d be like Oh, my God! You fell down! But no, we go. Oh, my God, you’re so cute.

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Lyle Crews: We kind of give ourselves that Grace and I got remind myself frequently things that we’re talking about. And it’s okay not to know all the answers. That fact you never will. And as you learn, there’s more. You don’t know that you do know, and you find resources to become resourceful, and, you know, to pick up the phone or how to go find the pathway as we talked earlier about doesn’t get less hard.

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Lyle Crews: But you learn how to navigate the hard, because, you know, for example, one of the my great things I’ve learned in property management. I’m not a roofer. I’m not a plumber, I’m not an electrician, and if you’re not doing plumbing every day.

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Lyle Crews: and even the plumber someone’s got, how much is the bid. It’s gonna be what it’s like. We’re changing the toll, I can tell you. But if I got to go behind those walls I have no idea, and it’s going to just depend how bad the problem is, unless you’re ex superman with X-ray vision, you’re not going to be able to tell until we open up those walls, and that costs will vary. So so, ladies and gentlemen, and what we get out of these experiences is, we learn how to articulate. I don’t know what I don’t know yet.

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Lyle Crews: Mr. Mr. Or Mrs. Owner. Here’s what we’re gonna go find out. I feel your pain.

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Lyle Crews: We’re going to get you some answers, and we’ll get some actual costs. We can make a decision. But can I anticipate exactly what that cost is going to be before they? No. So there’s a point when you get to the oh, I don’t have to know that, because there’s no way I can. So I in our industry, and that goes a thousand different directions.

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Lyle Crews: But one of our colleagues, Mr. Mr. Paul Rogan Camp, always says there’s no perfect properties, and there’s no perfect people, people, and he manage malls for like 30 years like

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Lyle Crews: you. I don’t care what type of asset class you’re going to deal with

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Lyle Crews: with a series of oh, my God! I can’t believe what happened today. You can’t make this stuff up type of stuff, and it’s that box of directional. Know how

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Lyle Crews: to know how to go begin to solve that problem. What makes this industry so day interesting and why we need so many creative problem solvers to help in all the areas to make our business and the model work better. So that’s kind of what we really preach in our program. Mark, you have any. Follow up final questions as we wrap up. I think that one of this one, the strong points that we have is that we give the students the tools to go to work with the next day

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Mark Potter: to perform. And it’s direct application. Baby.

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Mark Potter: it’s like, it’s like, solve that problem. Oh, I was. I can learn this last week in class. Oh, yeah, I know what to do, or if you don’t know what to do. Oh, let’s just take one more iteration, and you, you start with that research piece. So yeah, and I’m getting goose bumps again. So I got to. I just got so you know, Mark and Barry, Barry. It’s been a pleasure with the in our journey of getting to know each other over these last few months. I feel like I’ve known you forever, and it’s it’s

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Lyle Crews: it’s very comforting for us as professors and faculty to know

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Lyle Crews: that there’s folks like you who may seem on it, you know, that people can’t reach, and guys that lead into them. I’ll say you’ll find the very points of the world

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Lyle Crews: who love this industry and love education and love sharing, and you’ll notice that if you follow them, you know, through like the social media, he’s always out there trying to make the world a better place for those to follow behind. So I appreciate that so much, and we appreciate your time today, and then we hope that you all will enjoy this as much as Mark and I have.

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Lyle Crews: and hey, go make it happen out there, go get information and go discover your best version of yourself as we move on. And you know, we’ll see you guys on the other side. So thanks for the time and attention, and talk to you all later.

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Mark Potter: Thanks thanks very much. It was great.